Avengers for the Fourth Time Four Weeks Later

[ericadawn16]

Did I ever tell you the story of how we saw The Avengers the first time?

Yes, it was midnight like I said before. It was a 3D showing; the only option available. The trailers were great. Then, there was...nothing.

Really? Not only was it after midnight but we WAITED FOUR YEARS FOR THIS FREAKING MOVIE!
We get told that we will be moving across the hallway to a new auditorium with an untested 3D system.

Untested!

Yay!

The 3D was not as impressive as we were expecting, not as impressive as the Avengers trailer the week before. When I took the glasses off, there often no blurriness...the telltale hallmark of a 3D screening.

When we took the nephews, she was glad that it was 2D. However, I went a third time and it was 3D in the auditorium that we had started at. I thought it had been a lot better and my mom began wondering about what it would be like in real, professional 3D.

Thus, I went for a fourth time and she for a third time at a different theatre on June 4, 2012, exactly one month after our first midnight viewing.

The 3D was WAY BETTER!

I noticed this as soon as Loki appeared.

It's Tom Hiddleston and he's HUGE! HUGE all the over the screen and it seems like I could touch him!

*tries and fails*

My mom has decided that Loki is so popular and beloved because of Tom Hiddleston and in particular, his eyes. She says that his eyes are mischievous and happy and you can't believe that he could actually be capable of evil.

I will never get over how much I love Coulson is the first real face we see or how Clint gets to show how smart he is...well, every good Doctor Who knows this but...


I also keep forgetting but yes, I did notice the second DW reference later on... "reverse the polarity"

Oh Joss, I love you and if you ever a slow point again, I WANT a DW episode from you!
Actually, I always wanted a Torchwood one more but...

Have you guys read Nick Fury's Big Week yet? If not, you should. Not only does it explain whether Loki picked Barton on purpose or not...it has him driving back from New Mexico while Phil sleeps in the passenger seat...ADORABLE!

I admitted to my mom how whenever I see "Tasha" or "Natasha" jewelry at work, it makes me smile.
My mom: But she doesn't actually wear any. I don't think it would work out well in her line of work.
I really like her necklace in India though.

I also read the Avengers issue of D23. It's extremely expensive but my mom bought me my very first issue ever...I think it helped that Black Widow was on the front and Hawkeye on the back. Anyway, it has articles by the same guy who wrote The Art of The Avengers. It was extremely interesting including mentioning Stan Lee's OTHER scene. He encourages Steve to ask out the waitress, aww.

Also, there has been a lot of discussion, especially on Tumblr, about Steve's costume and why it became so skintight, well...

"Joss was very interested in a much more tight-fitting costume than the World War II version."

Thank you Joss, hehe.

I'm still disappointed that we don't really get to see Natasha's power suit in action. The book makes it look really cool with tasers and things.

Every time I watch, I see new stuff and still manage to miss other stuff. I did see everyone's floor on the blueprints this time with their symbol. My mom noticed Loki's spit on the wall. I keep getting distracted by their faces. We also made a point of noticing how the borrowed pants have a belt. My mom and I had a whole conversation on whether Bruce would bother with wearing a belt. Wouldn't it be painful when transforming? However, there didn't seem to be a problem. I still want pants like his, too. How freaking durable are those things?

Well, we had another Hulk conversation, too...

My mom: But his hand, it just...juts out and hits him. (mimes)
Me: But I think the Hulk is a lot more flexible than Bruce. He seems to be double-jointed.
My Mom: But I just don't think I could ever do that, not even when I was younger.
Me: I really don't think you should feel bad that you can't hit Thor like the Hulk can...

The book has some excerpts from the script but it just leaves me wanting more. For Cabin in the Woods, it was obvious that it had all these layers upon layers of depth but here's the sneaky, sneaky truth...

I think Avengers is just as bad but we get so distracted by the pretty and the explosions that we don't notice.

For one thing, reflections...

I don't know if you've noticed, they're EVERYWHERE! Natasha is in a mirror in Bruce's shot in India. Bruce is in Tony's shot on the Helicarrier. Loki is reflected in the containment glass.

It's not just the physical aspect of being able to have both characters without a static two-person shot...so many characters and actions mirror each other.

Tony Stark

Tony realizes his mirror on screen.

"Yeah. That's just a preview, this will be opening night. Loki's a full-tilt diva. He wants flowers, he wants parades, he wants a monument built in the skies with his name plastered...
[pause]
Son of a bitch!"

There's a man who has always felt he was in another's shadow. His father was cold and didn't make much time for him except pushing him to do better. He's brilliant which can lead to problems; mischief, public damage, scandal and he was in the business of making war, profited very nicely from it.

Yeah, Tony understands Loki. The brother relationship between Thor and Loki is mirrored in Steve and Tony. All his life, Tony has had to live with Steve; his father's first creation. It was another thing that he felt like he couldn't measure up to. On top of that, Steve only regards him with disdain and disappointment for most of the film. Thor shows more kindness to Loki despite all the killing. Although Loki tries not to care what his brother thinks, Tony cares a great deal about Steve's opinion and it's both Phil's belief in him and Steve's goading that cause him to make the suicide play.

However, unlike Loki, Tony finally got proof of his father's love just as he finally broke free and was finally making himself into a new person. He had to confront that his father and his legacy lives on in himself. Tony's ability to reinvent himself in a positive way is what Loki has to do but the tragedy is his refusal to accept it.

I also still love how Tony immediately goes and does the thing that he complained about Phil doing...except I guess he felt he was better prepared?

Bruce Banner

Actually, we're basically told this one, too. Tony is finally able to help him comes to terms with himself in a positive way as Tony has had to do before.

Natasha Romanov

Like Tony, she reflects the course that Loki could follow to have a more positive influence on society. As much as he insults her about the red in her ledger, it's a double-edged sword and he knows it as the scene with Thor later attests.

I really hope in the future that we get to see her power suit in action. It looked so freaking cool in the book.

I know there's more I'm forgetting and there's also the whole soldier thing. Tony is quick to insist that "we are not soldiers" and Clint tells Natasha "You're a spy, not a soldier." The ironic thing is that despite looking down on him and only having met Coulson that day, Steve seems to have caught onto something that Tony, knowing him several years, has not.
Coulson is a soldier.
It started off earlier in the film. Fury agreed that sentiment didn't win wars, "soldiers do." Fury is a soldier but calls Coulson "his one good eye." They've know each other a long time and Coulson is skilled in a variety of different abilities...but mostly, the irony of Steve figuring something out about Coulson even if it's accidental and Steve just thinks of everyone as soldiers...I think it sounds too good for Joss to pass up.

I'm also ashamed to admit missing the "J." on his badge but then, Phillip J always makes me think of Futurama.

Since Clint was the one to make a point out of telling Natasha SHE wasn't a soldier, I think movie Clint must have a military background. However, I think his upbringing/start must be similar to comic book Clint since he's made SHIELD into his family. It's why being turned against them is that much more tragic.

They better keep the circus aspect though because I love it, like Marvel's version of Dick Grayson but way cooler.

Steve Rogers

But I'm still annoyed at him for not signing the cards, you can't give him two seconds of your time? Really? Again, I know I asked for him to be a little more rounded, less perfect but not at the expense of Coulson and Tony.

Nick Fury

"Is Nick Fury the most manipulative guy in the world? Is he even a good guy? Is he completely Machiavellian, or is he a bit of both?
-Joss Whedon"

I still waver between wanting to be really mad at him for being such a sneaky, underhanded bureaucrat and feeling sorry for the position he's in and the pain you can see on his face, both as he looks at the cards and waits for word about Tony. However, it would also be really fun if the Avengers struggle with their SHIELD affiliation in the sequels and maybe even break away from it.

Loki

From D23 and the art book:

"But both Loki and the Chitauri are being manipulated by a shadowy puppet master, revealed in the film's post-credits scene."

"We will soon discover Loki is a pawn in a much bigger game."

Hmm... Someone suggested the idea that the scepter stone could be the Mind Gem. This seems very possible except that the Infinity Gauntlet is residing in Odin's vault on Asgard...but maybe it's an Infinity Fractal?

My Mom (randomly in the car afterwards): But we still don't know what happened in Budapest!
Me: I KNOW!!!!!!

Another quote from D23:
""I really thought the script was amazing; it was full of action, it was full of heart and spectacle and wit-and really, really funny."

Tom's right."

He usually is...

Comments

[cruel-fortuna.livejournal.com]

I saw Avengers in 3D the first time but all the subsequent times I've gone, I've seen it in 2D to save money. Mostly because I kind of just spent all my money on IMAX tickets to see The Dark Knight Rises; I wanted midnight tickets but damn it all if as soon as I was ready to check out the f'ing things sold out!

// I'm still in the process of trying to get my mom to like Tom. I've successfully converted & she is now a Cumberbitch but she refuses to join Loki's Army!

Speaking of Doctor Who, I want another Neil Gaiman episode.

In that case, does that mean Joss is the one who redesigned Loki's costume? Cause it went from OBVIOUS crotch in Thor to 'pfft please, they'll be none of that' in Avengers, I mean WTF!? ...I'm going to just go ahead & preemptively blame Joss.

Wasn't there also mention of a flamenco dancer in regards to Coulson. Because Steve had asked if he had anyone special & Tony actually knew. Hm... guess I'll have to go see the movie again.

[ericadawn16.livejournal.com]

Well, actually...

Alexandra Byrne said. "I also had the advantage of having worked closely with Chris and Tom through one production, and could capitalize on what I learned from them both in performance and movement. There was also benefit in what I learned through building the costumes for Thor. The costumes are very complex, and there were inevitably decisions and building choices that I wanted to refine. It can be that an early technical decision impacts time and time again through the building process - and although it was the right decision at that point in the process, as the costume comes near completion, a better solution becomes obvious. It could be as simple as where to place a zipper or where to make an articulation in a piece of armor."

Now, I know we like to study that area but a wrong seam or extra fabric can play tricks. In this case, I think they found out how fearless and unconcerned for his own safety Tom appeared to be with his stunts and his protective cup is what makes most of the bulge. In Avengers, they learned better how to disguise such things.

Flamenco dancer?
So not Phil's style, she's a cellist.
I've discussed her before in a couple of posts:
http://ericadawn16.livejournal.com/487484.html (http://ericadawn16.livejournal.com/487484.html)

http://ericadawn16.livejournal.com/490188.html (http://ericadawn16.livejournal.com/490188.html)

[cruel-fortuna.livejournal.com]

I shouldn't have laughed but lord ... I laughed when I read that bit about the cup. I have the emotional range of a teaspoon, sorry.

Lol honestly, ... I don't know where I got Flamenco.
I might have been watching the Australian vers. of Dancing with the Stars or ... I honestly don't know where I got flamenco. My bad. Cellist, ... that's what I meant to say.

[i-llbedammned.livejournal.com]

Tom Hiddleston's good looks and expressions definitely have contributed to the popularity of Loki, yes, but I don't think that's the only factor. It was also a detailed and well acted character.

I shall have to read Nick Fury's Big Week.

I think even if the Hulk feels pain he wouldn't register it until well after the battle was over. So things like belts or moving the wrong way just don't matter to him.

I actually never saw the connection between Tony and Loki before, but it make a lot of sense. I like the idea that they understand each other and that Steve and Tony have the brother relationship like Thor and Loki. Loki keeps looking for his father's approval, even though he will most likely never get it. He needs to break free like Tony did, a little.

I do like the parallels between Natasha and Loki. both have a lot of darkness in their past. Natasha just works on overcoming hers more while Loki seems unable to move past it and so it defines him.

Wow. I even forgot that Coulson was a soldier.

I kind of fell on the negative side for Nick Fury, but just barely. His actions in the end were good, but if the aim was to make weapons the damage that could have been done would have been horrific. In the end he pulled through, but I don't know if he feels like the weapons were wrong or right.

Either that or perhaps a gem went missing from the gauntlet during the gap. I mean Loki took the frost cube, who is to say he could not have taken a gem too? That is the gem that would totally call to him and his desire to manipulate people anyway.

[allisnow.livejournal.com]

I could just sit in the theater for the entire day and watch it back to back.

[allisnow.livejournal.com]

To back to back to back.

(P.S. I saw it in 3D IMAX the second time. The 3D was okay but the IMAX was fantastic.)

[sea_thoughts]

Another theme is 'sentiment'. Loki goes on and on about how sentiment is a weakness (which is HILARIOUS because he is nothing but sentiment) but the film shows that sentiment - belief - is what empowers people. It's what drives Coulson's sacrifice, Natasha's determination to get Clint back, Tony reaching out to Bruce, Bruce coming back... I don't even need to talk about Thor and Steve, who are all about belief and never giving up.

[ericadawn16.livejournal.com]

And not just sentiment but sentiment and old-fashioned being so entwined against the modern and weapons. Steve starts off being frustrated about this. "Didn't mention that we'd lost" "Isn't that a little old-fashioned?"

This was one thing where I wasn't sure if I agreed with Fury's Big Week, it had Coulson very involved in the development of the Destroyer gun but in the film, he has access to the gun but does seem surprised at what it does/effectiveness. It makes me think he wasn't that involved and just knew of it since he's the Marvel version of Ianto and knows everything.

[sea_thoughts]

Exactly. Sentimentality, as represented by Steve and Thor, against rationality, represented by Tony, Natasha, Bruce (some of the time). Of course, if you're too rational, then you end up like zombified Clint and Selvig. And if you're too sentimental and allow yourself to be overcome by your emotions... well, Loki's an extreme example but nevertheless a valid one.

[ericadawn16.livejournal.com]

Although Loki said as he picked Clint how "you have heart" and it's clear how true that is later on after Natasha knocks him out.

"a fool who wears his heart on his sleeve"

Normally, I try to avoid Snape parallels with Loki but it was too obvious not to use that phrase...

[sea_thoughts]

Yeah, exactly. Clint's heart is what makes him Clint, which is why he's so dangerous without it.

"a fool who wears his heart on his sleeve"

Normally, I try to avoid Snape parallels with Loki but it was too obvious not to use that phrase...

Just came back from seeing it a fourth time and I was astounded by the realisation that every speech Loki made about 'other people' was really about him. When he talks to the crowd about the mad rush for freedom and identity, he's the one who's lost and searching for an identity, not them. When he talks to Natasha about how she lies and kills while serving liars and killers, when he tells her that the horrors are a part of her and will never go away - that's ALL HIM. He tells himself that he's better than the Chitauri and that he'll rule the Earth and make it a better place, but he's lying to himself.

And I also noticed that the movie uses Steve being wrong about Tony to distract the audience from the fact he's right about everything else. *lol*

God, I love Whedon's writing.

[ericadawn16.livejournal.com]

Yep

Me, too, I've been so spoiled by having Cabin in the Woods and this so close together that I'm sure I'll start going into Whedon withdrawal later this year...

I am making due currently with Veronica Mars which I've forgotten how brilliant it really is...and on Tuesday, they're airing the episode where Joss makes a cameo...it's been like 7 years so I don't remember it super well...the ad even has Joss' recommendation, hehe.